Turbo Still not right....

[dgallo]

All,

I posted a thread a few weeks ago regarding a problem I am having with my 86 SVO. The car would hesitate and have a loss of power at 12psi and higher. Eric recommended I do a bunch of things and I did. The car is a bit better, but I still can't get any power out of the car past 12psi of boost. I checked all my hoses, vaccum lines, full tune up (plugs, wires, cap/rotor, coil, airfilter, oil change, fuel filter.) The timing is good and set to factory, I took the BCS off and replaced it with a Gillis valve. I found a kink in the PVC return fuel line and straightened it out. The car now seems to pull real good to 12psi, anything above it she hesitates a little and there is a noticable loss of power. I have noticed that when I back off throtlle from wide open to 3/4 she smooths out. I'm getting close. I would love to hear some suggestions. My guesses are: TPS is bad, Fuel Pressure/regulator, maybe EGR valve. I've pretty much replaced everything else. I also did notice that my VANE meter was a little oily on the inside due to the A/C compressor puking everywhere when I first got the car. How do you clean out a VANE Meter? Again, any help would be appreciated. Thanks all.

Dan
86 2R

[svono50]

Dan, What is your base timing set at and what did you gap your plugs to? Both of these items can effect high boost performance.

[dgallo]

I forget off the top of my head, but I set them both to what the little tag said in the engine compartment. Plugs were like .032 and timing was 10 BDC. Changing the coil had no effect on the performance. I did also use all motorcraft tuneup stuff as I read that on this Forum.

[SVOeric]

a couple of things,

oil in the VAM, & hoses can cause a lot of problems.  You need to check the hoses, and intercooler, and throtle body for oil, if there is much in there, that can certinly be the cause of your problems.

That oil can cause detonation, wihich could be causing your knock sensor to kick, which retards the timing (hense hesitation)

Also, make sure timing was set to 10 deg with the spout removed -- This is very important.

 

[svono50]

Dan,

It sounds like you are on the right track. For a test try turning your timing down to 8 deg and/or regapping your plugs to 0.028-0.030 and see what happens. If your problems go away, it could be related to your gas octane or the oil in your intake system (as Eric mentioned).

Oil will ignite before your spark its and give you pre-ignition, not very nice on the ole head gasket. The oil is most likely coming from your PCV system, which inputs into your turbo inlet. Make sure your PCV valve is a Ford unit and clean your intake as much as possible and see how your car performs.

[dgallo]

It's definately not the gas, I am running super in it with a splash of octane booster. The oil in the vane was in front right after the air filter. Can I just spray the vane out with carb or brake cleaner? I could replace the TPS, EGR and fuel regulator for the sake of it since I have done almost everything else. I will check the timing and plugs again, and replace the PCV. That will keep me busy for a while. I should probably get a better boost gague too.

[SVOeric]

You could replace the TPS, and EGR, but I kinda doubt that is where your problems are.  Another thing that would be good to do would be run codes on the computer, make sure you check the stored codes too.

take the intercooler off, and if you can feel oil inside the hoses, and throttle body, you probably have a pcv issue.  Get all that oil cleaned up, (carb cleaner works well for this)

Be careful on your gas too, I have seen many a store sell "93" when in fact, they were selling you 87, or 98

 

[svocudd]

Detonation

I was thinking the same as Eric. If oil is getting in it could be causing detonation which forces the knock sensor to remove timing (and boost?) which may feel like a miss or a stutter.

Also the knock sensors are known to go bad and/or pick up false knocks (such as the infamous intercooler bracket rattles/vibrations). Check to make sure your brackets are tight (not that that makes them stop rattling/vibrating by the way, but it helps) I personally chose to unhook my knock sensor (not a recommended option by many) and listen very carefully for audible detonation. I to ran 94 octane fuel and with my Gillis valve set at 20 psi was detonation free under all but the worse air condition. Set your boost to a safe level 15-16 or so with that Gillis valve and unhook the knock sensor and see if things smooth out on the top end.

Definately get an Autometer Boost gauge!


Cudd

[dgallo]

okay here'as a dumb one, where exactly is the knock sensor? Also I have a free spout on my vaccum tree on the firewall, can I hook a new Boost gague to that?? How about cleaning out the VANE meter? Can I just hose the inside down with some carb cleaner?? Thanks guys. Wish i could make the reunion to meet everyone.

[svobud]

Originally posted by dgallo
okay here'as a dumb one, where exactly is the knock sensor?

Underneath the lower intake.

How about cleaning out the VANE meter? Can I just hose the inside down with some carb cleaner??

don't use carb cleaner. throttle body cleaner (maybe)...but it would be best to just hand whipe it with a clean cloth.

[svocudd]

knock sensor

Oops, I meant to mention the knock sensor is on the back side of the lower intake (on an 86 SVO). I agree with Bud. Just wipe the VAM down. Alos check the accordian hose in between the VAM and the turbo it usually retains oil in the folds. THat you can spray out with carb cleaner. I have also heard of intercollers getting oil in them but I have never experienced this.


Cudd

[SVOeric]

oh yea.. on the VAM -- you are better off not to use any chemicals -- it has sensors in there!!!

i was talking about the hoses, and other stuff.. I SHOULD have been more spcific

thanks Bud & Cudd

[richsvo]

Dgallo,

If you want to get the VAM (Vane Air Meter) as clean as it can be, don't use carb cleaner, use a cleaner that is safe for electronics...there are a ton of them out there. They are safe to spray directly on electronic parts...(ie: circuit boards, etc.) and they evaporate very quickly. I have done this a million times, with no problems. Just make sure it is safe for electronics, though. The same people that make the "Brake Kleen" (in the red can) make one, is is also in a red can, and sold at common stores like Ace Hardware, etc. I think the brand is "electrosol"..., or something like that. Makes that oil just flow out of the VAM, and in about a minute, it is all evaporated.

As far as testing it, I agree, disconnect the knock sensor, and CAREFULLY listen for detonation, if that solves the problem, then it is definitely something making that knock sensor react. (vibration, etc.)

Hope that helps...

Rich

[dgallo]

Turbo Problem fixed!!

Well gang, with all your help, it turned out to be the knock senor causing the problem. I diconnected it and BAM!!, she pulls like a mad dog up to 15psi!! Thanks again for all your help. Slowly but surely I am learning about these killer little turbos.

[SVOeric]

You should be careful with it unplugged.  A bit of detonation can cause a head gasket to pop rather quickly.

The best thing to do is to find out what was setting the KS off, and fix it.

If you're not getting any detonation with it unpluged, that is good, but one really hot day, and a bit too much boost can cause big problems.