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Thread: My SN95 LCA Install

  
  1. #16
    12 PSI Boost Daily 86 SVO's Avatar
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    Bill - I did keep the SVO spindle, brakes, and struts, I only changed out the LCA and Springs (along with the MM ball joint adaptor). I did follow that other post, but really couldn't come to a conclusion as to what everyone was doing, so I tried it myself. It doesn't EXACTLY line up when trying to jack the arm into place, but it will if you 'bevel' the area the rubber bushing/sleeve initially hits before going into the bolt pocket. You might have to get a C clamp to 'tuck' the rubber bushing in so it goes into the beveled area (grease that area up will help). Once in, it looks fine. I was also able to keep the sway bar, it just bolts to the arm at a slight angle (I can't tell the difference in handling).

    So in summary, are all of these changes ideal to the specific handling of the SVO? Probably not, but my goal was to get the car back on the road to enjoy it again without spending a gob money on NOS items. I've owned the SVO for almost 20 years now, and would like to see it back on road a lot more than the last couple of years.
    86 SVO
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  2. #17
    OVER-BOOST!! svono50's Avatar
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    Thanx for the info/update, looks they can work with minimal modifications.

    With the sway bar end links on a slight angle, keep any eye out on the bushings, since they are under a little more stress than normal. When I initially the Fox bar on my car with the stock control arms, basically opposite of what you have (Fox bar is slightly narrower), I ended up blowing out my poly bushings and bending the end links after just one track day. I am guessing they would have lasted longer if I had only street driven them, but just noting it for reference. Hopefully you won't have the same issue.
    Ted
    86 SVO Mustang
    17 Cooper S Clubman ALL4

  3. #18
    14 PSI Boost
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    SVO's: 1985 1/2 9L
    Thanks Daily. My primary motivation is to try to get a better set of front brakes, although I haven't given up on the SVO brakes just yet. I had an unfortunate incident at a track day last weekend where my brakes faded to zero going coming off a fast straight into a tight corner where I have to scrub off about 70MPH. I went through a sand trap and just bumped a tire wall. No real damage to the car, a couple of black marks from the tire wall and some chipped paint, but I don't want to go through that again. I have upgraded the SVO brakes to about as good as they can get, I can improve the cooling ductwork a bit and not run with the OEM wheels, but there is a limited selection of track-worthy pads. I was running Hawk Blue pads which have been pretty good up until now but they really let me down this weekend. If I go to the SN95 arms and 94/95 spindles I can get much better brakes with better pad selection and still be "OEM". I'd have to go to 17" wheels but that's OK too since there is a better selection of tires in 17" too.

    Thanks for your feedback and information. Very helpful.

  4. #19
    OVER-BOOST!! gbeaird's Avatar
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    First of all, did you nose in to the tire wall, or hit it with some other part of the car? If nose in, then double-check the front header panel. Those things get brittle with age and can crack when the bumper cover is pushed around. My wife accidentally rolled into someone with our 86, barely bumping the rear bumper of the car ahead. It was enough to shatter the header panel. We lost some pieces that make it difficult to reassemble the OEM panel. Luckily, I got a repro unit when it was available.

    Second, are you bleeding the brakes before every track day? When the brake fluid gets heat-cycled, especially close to the point of boil, the boiling temp will drop. Best to bleed before every event. I think the Hawk pads should be pretty good. Anything else more aggressive will eat rotors.
    Gene Beaird,
    86 2R SVO, G Stock,
    Pearland, Texas

  5. #20
    14 PSI Boost
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    SVO's: 1985 1/2 9L
    Hey Gene. Hit the tire wall with the left front corner, pretty much at a 45 degree angle. It did distort the bumper cover enough to crack the paint, but it didn't break anything like the corner marker light. I have it up on the lift and have examined the brakes and all the structure and it looks OK. I got really lucky. I have Hawk Blue pads and Stoptech slotted rotors that have only been on the car since February. I've run five events since it was all new. The brakes have been performing quite well and I haven't had much in the way of fade until this weekend. They were losing bite earlier in that lap and I started braking 100 feet earlier at that corner but when I did, there was virtually no bite at first and then went to next to nothing. The rears locked up. I had pedal but no bite. I haven't been bleeding before each event, but I think I will from here out. Cheap insurance and easy enough to do. One thing that was different at this event than earlier ones this year is that I was running the OEM wheels instead of the Enkei wheels I usually run. There is some debate, I know, about the brake cooling effect of an open wheel as opposed to a closed design like the OEMs, but I gotta believe that the open spokes of the Enkeis allow for more/better airflow over the brakes, and allow them to cool off better between sessions. When I took the car to the wash rack to hose off the sand, easily an hour after the event, the front wheels instantly evaporated the water stream in a cloud of steam when I hit it with the hose. The brakes were really, really hot. I have 3" ducts from the fog lamp openings to the brake area, but pointing into the spindle/strut/steering arm area, not directly into the back of the rotor. I just don't see how there is enough room to fashion a real 3" duct backing plate for the OEM brakes. They are just too small and there is too much stuff in the way.

    The Hawk blue pads are pretty hard on the rotors. I had to push the pistons back just to get the calipers off due to the ridge on the outer perimeter of the rotor, and they were brand new in February.

  6. #21
    OVER-BOOST!! svono50's Avatar
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    Cisco...the stock wheels really, really suck at airflow for events like a track day. I remember back at an early Reunion the guys running the stock wheels were cooking their pads and I was running 96 Cobra wheels and didn't have an issue all day, even w/o performance pads. Airflow is king when trying to keep out of the sand traps. I currently run stock rotors/calipers, no cooling ducts, no dust/splash shields, Stillen Metal Matrix pads, RBF600 fluid and TSW Nurburgring (i.e.- very open) wheels and haven't had any issues with track days. Now, I have learned how to adjust my braking method to keep my pads/fluid alive as well. The stock system seems to prefer late/harder braking rather than a longer braking scenario, which I have come to find over the past several years from both pedal feel and my nose (i.e.- brake smell isn't a good thing). I do a 100% flush at the start of the season and will quick flush out enough to refresh the caliper amount of fluid before each successive event, as the fluid up in the lines isn't effected to the degree of the fluid in the caliper. YMMV.
    Ted
    86 SVO Mustang
    17 Cooper S Clubman ALL4

  7. #22
    14 PSI Boost
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    SVO's: 1985 1/2 9L
    Hey Ted. Yeah, I agree about the OEM wheels. I've seen arguments that the heavy mass of aluminum acts as a heat sink for the brakes, which has some merit, but if there isn't any way for that big chunk of aluminum to dissipate the stored heat, it is only good until it gets heat-soaked and then your toast. Just my experience this year at earlier events with the Enkei wheels seems to support the "open is better" argument. My incident was going into turn 1 at Atlanta Motorsport Park. It is at the end of the longest straight and into a 90 degree downhill left turn so you have to scrub at lot of speed. But, it isn't nearly as bad as going into turn 10 at Road Atlanta, also a 90 degree left at the end of a straight, but I am hitting well over 120 MPH at RA and probably only 90 or so at AMP. I haven't had fade issues at Road Atlanta this year with the Enkei wheels.

    I don't think I boiled the fluid. From what I understand when you do that you lose the pedal. I had a hard pedal, just no bite. Looking at the Hawk pad characteristics
    https://www.tirerack.com/images/pdf/...und-Charts.pdf
    the Blue compound falls off a cliff over 1000 degrees. I have a hard time believing that they got that hot, but they surely did fall off the cliff.

    My driving style is normally the "wait until you see god" and then threshold brake so I do use them hard, but, like you, I think that is a better situation than dragging them and slowing less quickly. It's faster too! Less time on the brakes = more time on the gas. However, that doesn't leave a lot of room for error (or brake fade).

  8. #23
    14 PSI Boost fast Ed's Avatar
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    If you want to go with SN95 brakes but stay with 16" wheels, you could do what the American Iron guys were years back ... the SN95 spindles with Cobra PBR calipers and brackets, and redrill the mounting holes in the brackets 1/2" lower so that the calipers go over 12" diameter rotors instead of 13". Then by slightly shimming the brackets to centre them, they will fit over 2003+ Crown Vic / Grand Marquis / Town Car OEM front rotors. Originally guys were paying to cut the 13" rotors down to 12", then on the Corner-Carvers forum between several of us we came up with this alternate solution so that wear items would all be off-the-shelf parts.


    cheers
    Ed
    84 SVO 1E, option delete 11/83 prod.
    95 Jaguar XJR, also boosted


  9. #24
    14 PSI Boost
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    SVO's: 1985 1/2 9L
    Thanks Ed. Pretty good amount of work, but it is an option to keep my 16" wheels.

  10. #25
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    SVO's: 1985 1/2 9L

    99-04 GT front brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by fast Ed View Post
    If you want to go with SN95 brakes but stay with 16" wheels, you could do what the American Iron guys were years back ... the SN95 spindles with Cobra PBR calipers and brackets, and redrill the mounting holes in the brackets 1/2" lower so that the calipers go over 12" diameter rotors instead of 13". Then by slightly shimming the brackets to centre them, they will fit over 2003+ Crown Vic / Grand Marquis / Town Car OEM front rotors. Originally guys were paying to cut the 13" rotors down to 12", then on the Corner-Carvers forum between several of us we came up with this alternate solution so that wear items would all be off-the-shelf parts.


    cheers
    Ed
    Hey Ed, did you ever consider the 99-04 GT brake setup, which is a dual 43mm caliper on an 11" disk? I wonder if that would be a worthwhile improvement over the SVO brakes if I swapped to the 94-95 spindles. I would imagine that it would clear the 16" wheels OK as the disk diameter is the same as the SVO. Hawk does make a HT10 pad for that caliper which is a step up from the Blue pad.

    Thx
    Bill H

  11. #26
    14 PSI Boost fast Ed's Avatar
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    With the base 99-04 brake setup you get the different PBR caliper than the Cobra system, and the rotor is basically the same size as the stock SVO rotor. The caliper and mounting is an improvement over stock, and gives you more pad selection, but for track days you're not getting any more rotor mass for heat dissipation. For just street driving or the occasional autocross / track day, I'd see it as an upgrade. To put those calipers on the early SN95 spindles, there is a bit of grinding required to get enough clearance for full caliper movement, but it's not a big deal.

  12. #27
    12 PSI Boost Daily 86 SVO's Avatar
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    Update: Suspension should be completely seated, my son has been driving it all around so far this summer. Here is a pic from tonight (again, B Springs with NO isolators):
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    86 SVO
    89 LX 5.0
    88 Saleen 351-blown
    99 Saleen

  13. #28
    OVER-BOOST!! svono50's Avatar
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    Looks nice and level to me in the pics. I like the stance!
    Ted
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  14. #29
    OVER-BOOST!! JTurbo's Avatar
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    Ditto, looks awesome.
    86 SVO 1C

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