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Thread: rods

  
  1. #1
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    rods

    So my block has been at the machinist for 2 weeks or something like that. I just called him up yesterday to see what the status is and he told me that I should call up esslinger to get their piston and rod deal. That sounded good to me because he said it was less than what he was orginally going to get the parts for and they are a better quality. Cool! Today I was looking at the deal and I noticed that the rods are 5.7 "long rods." I don't know if this is bad or what. I did a search earlier to find out what the stock length or the rods are supposed to be but couldn't find anything. Are these the correct length rods?

    Thanks everyone =)

  2. #2
    OVER-BOOST!! svoman2300's Avatar
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    I don't think the piston and rod deal from Esslinger includes turbo pistons. But I could be wrong.
    Rick

    84 1C
    80 AMC Eagle
    01 Jincheng 50( with 70 big bore)

  3. #3
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    There's a difference between turbo and non-turbo pistons? If so, what are turbo pistons?

  4. #4
    Administrator SVOeric's Avatar
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    turbo pistons are FORGED --

    and -- Dont let anyone sell you hyperbaulic (spelling)

  5. #5
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    Well it seems to be ok then. The listing says that the piston are forged wisecos. From the other posts I have been reading people say these are the best.

  6. #6
    OVER-BOOST!!
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    I've read several places that the SVO 2.3 rods are the same as the Boss 302 rods (C8ZZ or C80Z?). Otherwise it sounds like the rods are not a weak point.
    84 SVO 1 owner, 02 S.Crew, 69 Mustang, 85 McLaren

  7. #7
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    I just called up esslinger because I have been getting very worried that what I ordered wouldn't work in my block. The technician I talked to said that the piston that comes in the kit is the shorter top so that the 5.7 rods will work with it. Whew! That makes me feel a lot better.

    I do realize that my compression is going to go up do to the flat top but I'm hoping i can tune it so that it's not a problem. (Thanks for all that valuable info MikeFlemming!)

  8. #8
    Banned 8T6 SVO's Avatar
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    SVO's: 86 1E -340WHP@12psi
    Originally posted by Wizard191
    I just called up esslinger because I have been getting very worried that what I ordered wouldn't work in my block. The technician I talked to said that the piston that comes in the kit is the shorter top so that the 5.7 rods will work with it. Whew! That makes me feel a lot better.

    I do realize that my compression is going to go up do to the flat top but I'm hoping i can tune it so that it's not a problem. (Thanks for all that valuable info MikeFlemming!)
    Reread what Mike Flemming has to say and understand it.

    When you increase the rod length to a 5.5" or 5.7" rod and mantain the same displacement (2.3 litres) the pin location is raised in the piston. This has a great effect on the durability and location of the rings. In the picture Mike posted earlier on this post, it shows the oil control ring (bottom ring space) location at the piston pin. There are problems associated with this.

    You are not raising the compression ratio due to flat top pistons. The compression ratio should be down around 8:1 with any turbo piston you are using. If you increase the compression, you will need to run race gas, limit your boost, etc. Higher compression turbo motors typically are for racers who are after a certain set- up.

    Racer Walsh has some good pictures on there web site of the difference in long rod pistons compared to stock. Look it up.

  9. #9
    Banned 8T6 SVO's Avatar
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    SVO's: 86 1E -340WHP@12psi

    Stock piston

    Here's a picture of a Stock Ford Forged 2.3L turbo piston. Notice the difference between this piston and the one Mike Flemming has posted earlier. There is more space between the rings and the oil control ring is not in the piston pin space (as is the case with Mike's posted piston due to the longer rod).

    Oh - Racer Walsh has changed the web site since I last looked. I couldn't find the pictures of the pistons.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails mvc-018s.jpg  
    Last edited by 8T6 SVO; 08-07-2004 at 01:11 AM.

  10. #10
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    So what I understand is that because I have a longer rod this decreases the spacing between the rings. This is bad for a turbo car, but how bad is it really? Should I be afraid of having a piston shoot out soon or will it just reduce performance?

    I was looking at race engineers and racer walshes site and the deal I am getting through esslinger does seem to be pretty good, however if you guys are saying that it's setting me up for a big down fall I'll return them and get the right stuff.

    On another note: on racer walshe's site I notice that he differentiates between turbo application rings and standard rings. What's the difference? and are all gapless rings good for turbo applications?

  11. #11
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    Thanks, Mike for setting the story straight on the rod issue. Now if I can just find that guy who started the rumor. I believe part numbers not rumors.
    84 SVO 1 owner, 02 S.Crew, 69 Mustang, 85 McLaren

  12. #12
    Banned 8T6 SVO's Avatar
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    SVO's: 86 1E -340WHP@12psi

    Short pistons

    Originally posted by Wizard191
    So what I understand is that because I have a longer rod this decreases the spacing between the rings. This is bad for a turbo car, but how bad is it really? Should I be afraid of having a piston shoot out soon or will it just reduce performance?

    1. Short piston ring spacing does not give a high degree of
    support to the piston rings.

    2. Having the oil control ring interfer with the piston pin location
    reduces the "oil control" effectiveness of the oil control ring as
    well as reduces the support of this ring.

    3. The short piston & long rod set up will work, but you are
    sacraficing reliability. Do you need this for a street car? The
    answer is up to you.

  13. #13
    Banned 8T6 SVO's Avatar
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    SVO's: 86 1E -340WHP@12psi

    2.3 stock rods

    Originally posted by KevinK
    Thanks, Mike for setting the story straight on the rod issue. Now if I can just find that guy who started the rumor. I believe part numbers not rumors.
    From what I have read, ALL 2.3L Ford motors, turbo or N/A use the same rod.

  14. #14
    14 PSI Boost MikeLTDLX's Avatar
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    Flat Tops

    If you bought flat tops you are going to raise your compression. I don't know why anyone would say that you aren't. Flat tops have no dish, therefore you have less total combustion chamber volume and you have more compression. Take a look at the dish on a stock turbo piston.....

    Flat top pistons generally yield 9:1 compression with a turbo head.

    If you are going to run this setup, you better have a very reliable boost controller and a good tune. Otherwise you stand a good chance of breaking the ring lands on the piston under detonation. Also, to you are goin to be limited in max boost potential.

    With that said, the "feel" of a long rod motor is very different. You will significantly lighten the rotating assembly....the results are very nice.

    Mike
    Last edited by MikeLTDLX; 08-08-2004 at 10:46 AM.
    '86 2R

  15. #15
    OVER-BOOST!! Wizard191's Avatar
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    I thought that my compression would go up when I ordered flat tops because i did notice that the old one were domed. However, I was hoping that the offset of the the 30 over bore would help to compensate for the change to flat tops. Am I correct in this assumption?

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